Discussion time... please contribute!!

[Stu]

Pmurgs has a very good point. This would not be a simple process. No offence to the BBH guys I feel kind of special to [grrr] seeing as I was bought with an AWESOME razor Mouse and Mouse-pad ... I am cheap after all! thanks Grrr-of-Old (by old I'm referring to j0n0 and Geth)

But I've always felt that members who go through the application process have a good induction to the clan and this gives me the sense of belonging I had to work to get in it's not just a matter of pitching up and joining the party. We are generally an invite only clan and should we have a few stray sheep turn up at our doors we are willing to give them a chance.


What I am not happy about is the possibility of this upsetting and or leading to the resignation of existing clan members no matter how others feel about this, this to me is unacceptable and I would hope that this can be avoided at all costs. I am positive from a logical point of view this makes sense. But we have to be honest with ourselves.

What is the grrr identity how has this been built over the past 3-4 years? Yes a merger would make us more competitive in the sense of gaming we are a gaming clan after all. But do we run the chance of loosing that ever so unique grrrness? If there is the faintest possibility of this ever happening then I am against this process.
It is a very complicated and layered situation we have here.

Another point that has been mentioned is the controlling stake in [grrr] know i know if a merger would take place BBH become [grrr] but would this be the end result? Would there be no other power plays and underling agenda's?

Partnerships of this sort are tricky and we all know this from a corporate sense things can turn ugly when internal power struggles start to rear their ugly head. My main point is how do we keep as much of the current status quo?

[J_Th4ng]

Hi guys. Sorry I've not commentewd before now, but I've been on my hols, and just got back.

Some great open and frank discussion going on here, I like it!! It throws out all of the things that we will have to address as a clan going forward. I intend to respond to everyone's thoughts and posts, but just don't have the time to right now.

One thing that I do have to say though, and need to get it said now:

THE MERGER IS OFF

Amusing, with all our discussions about whether or not we would want to allow them join us, they have decided that they don't want to join. Although Chaos was very keen on the idea, the rest of his guys weren't.

We will need to discuss the future of the Danglers and Nutz teams in the short term, as BBH now have sufficient players to enter their own team in the second phase of competition. Chaos has said that he'd gladly keep on whichever of the Grrr Nutz players as want to be in the team, but clearly we need to sort out our own team first.

Lee and I will discuss our team requirements, and approach the as many players from the Nutz squad as we need in order to have a complete Danglers team for leg 2. Skoups, I perfectly understand that your loyalties are with the Nutz team for now, but at this stage, your CLAN needs the players so that we can enter a full team ourselves. Of course any Nutz player who is approached to join the Danglers has the right to refuse, but in my opinion if you want to choose the BBH team over the grrr team, you should then probably question which clan you want to belong to.

Let's revisit this discussion in terms of our teams that we are going to enter. The Merger with BBH is off, but that doesn't change the relationship between the two clans. Sorry to get everyone all stirred up and then drop it like this, I probably shouldn't have said anything until Vinko had completed the discussions with his guys.

[Skouperd]

Lee and I will discuss our team requirements, and approach the as many players from the Nutz squad as we need in order to have a complete Danglers team for leg 2. Skoups, I perfectly understand that your loyalties are with the Nutz team for now, but at this stage, your CLAN needs the players so that we can enter a full team ourselves. Of course any Nutz player who is approached to join the Danglers has the right to refuse, but in my opinion if you want to choose the BBH team over the grrr team, you should then probably question which clan you want to belong to.

It goes without saying that grrr's needs need to be satisfied first (especially if the merger is off), and if the Danglers need more players, I will without hesitation make myself available for selection again. (as I am sure all the other Nutz will as well). It will be really daft not to accept such an honour.

[baselineac]

well im sorry i missed this post......it would have been nice to push some buttons and stir some shit again....
but on a more serious note.......
i really miss you lot especially on the gaming side, and hope to have some sort of a solution to my interwebs problem soon...it really seems as if you poor bastards needs a decent bc2 player. seeing as you are losing alot of games......ill be back soon

[Jackal-GI]

I am also working hard on getting an internet connection, it looks like the telkom line is never going to happen because i am still waiting since last year october. My brother will hopefully have a line by this comming friday and will then be able to join in on the bc2 action. Me on the other hand will try to go the iburst way and see if i can get a decent connection from them to be able to join in on the bc2 action. I am really very excited to get back into the awesomeness that is grrr. I feel lost and cut off. I really hope iburst can help me. Anyway if things work out i will see you all soon online and i do want a part in one of the grrr teams it will be an honour as always.
PS> thanks for having patience with the members that is inactive for a long time it really means you guys see each member as family and thats what makes grrr that extra special and quite frankly my life wouldn't be the same if it weren't for you guys. Thanks for everything so far GRRR

[Phatso]

Interesting stuff Jarrod.

It seems the saying is true, everything happens for a reason.

We now have got some interesting points of view on our current team structure and can use these valuable insights to grow more as a clan firstly and as a team secondly

[J_Th4ng]

Lee and I will discuss our team requirements, and approach the as many players from the Nutz squad as we need in order to have a complete Danglers team for leg 2. Skoups, I perfectly understand that your loyalties are with the Nutz team for now, but at this stage, your CLAN needs the players so that we can enter a full team ourselves. Of course any Nutz player who is approached to join the Danglers has the right to refuse, but in my opinion if you want to choose the BBH team over the grrr team, you should then probably question which clan you want to belong to.

It goes without saying that grrr's needs need to be satisfied first (especially if the merger is off), and if the Danglers need more players, I will without hesitation make myself available for selection again. (as I am sure all the other Nutz will as well). It will be really daft not to accept such an honour.

Hey guys,

I wjust want to make it clear that my previous post was not meant as any kind of threat or intimidation tactic, and I apologise if it came across that way - I must've been having a bad day when I wrote that, as it does read a little harsh in reflection.

The point that I was trying to make was simply that BBH have said to me that they will be entering their own team for the next leg of the league as they now have sufficient players avilable. Chaos has offered to keep on the grrr Nutz players in their team if their is no space for them in the Danglers, simply becuase you guys have played together and he'd hate to see you without a team. However, at this time we are in real need of players to bolster the Danglers team. I don't know if the Nutz players are aware of this, but for the last month or so we have been struggling just to scrape together 8 players for each game, not to mention having any reserves. This is due to a number of factors, but certainly has't been helped by the following:

* Geth going to the Chad
* Grav vanishing (still seems to be the case)
* Me having to spend a lot of time travelling
* Phatso moving house and having hardware/connection issues
* Icenflame having no ADSL (great for forum legibility, not so great for our BC2 team)

Considering that we had an 11 man squad, these issues with manpower were significant hurdles to overcome. It left us ill prepared and unable to compete at the level that was required.

It is my firm belief thatw e need the three active members of the Nutz team (Skoups, Daz and Murgs) to bolster the squad of the ONLY team that grr has entered in the league. And that those three individuals are not being asked to join simply to make up the numbers, you are all great players and we need your participation to improve our competitiveness.

Grrr is a clan witha proud history of competing well in everything that we do. We may not be the best, but we sure as hell give our bst. It has been immensely frustrating for me (and everyone else in the clan, I hope) that we have not lived up to our full potential with our primary team. I am the first to admit that I made a mistake by only allocating a squad of 11 for the Danglers team. I thought it would be enough people, I was wrong.

Murgs, Daz and Skoups, please help us to show the other participants in the league how competitive grrr can be.

[gr@v1ty]

Before reading through all the replies, just wanted to air my first thoughts on the main post. Merger? Cool idea with some of the BBH guys. Don't know exactly who is in the BBH side atm but Chaos and U2M come to mind as the main guys.
If merging means that we can play on the same team when we play in leagues, can't we do that already?
On the other hand, merging means that we'll start up a whole SGS forum rant when we're all in the same side. Not playing in the same side might cause some sensitive issues with players. (Players thinking, "Why don't they want to squad up with us?" :sulk

Anyway, it'll take a long time of playing together first before officially merging. I reckon the soonest is probably about rage time (if it's still a going concern). Any sooner than that and I reckon it could take a long time to rebuild what we have at the moment.

(now to continue with reading the replies)

[Skouperd]

I wjust want to make it clear that my previous post was not meant as any kind of threat or intimidation tactic, and I apologise if it came across that way - I must've been having a bad day when I wrote that, as it does read a little harsh in reflection.

Harsh? you call that harsh? Dude, that is WAY past harsh!!! Geez, I nearly slit my hooves when I've seen that....

Ok, seriously now, you are right, BBH want to enter their own team. And as Chaos mentioned on numerous occasions, he would like to keep the 3 of us that played for the Nutz before. However, as Dragonne indiciated, the Danglers is in greater need of our services since the 3 of us never missed a game. Saying that, this does mean that BBH is under some pressure to confidently enter a team, since if there is a single person unable to play (which always happens), they will not be able to field 8 people in the game. In order to maintain good relationships between the two clans, herewith a suggestion:

The Danglers entered 16 players. Entering 16 players into a 8 player league might be seen as a little bit "over-reaction" to last monts inability to present a squad of 8. Now some of those 16 players already indicated that they will not be able to fully commit to a league or anything. Theoretical, the "unable to commit" will most likely act as the reserves or in cases of emergencies etc. As such, can't we assign say 2 or 3 of these non-committers, to be reserve for BBH as well? That mean, should BBH not be able to get a player, then they could perhaps pull in (for a single game or two) these grrr players? If we give BBH 3 reserves, that still leaves the danglers with 13 players, (with 3 of the Nutz having an excellent comitment track record).

Why do I even care what happens with BBH, well, if grrr is to be converted into a brand name within the South African Gaming Scene, then the more gaming teams South Africa can enter, and the more grrr help them to enter, then surely it is counting towards our brand name? (the fact that I've played a whole leg with them, also might influence my decision a little bit...)

Ergo, I see this as a win win situation, since not only will more grrr players get game time, it also increases the brand value, improve inter-clan-relations and help out our sister clan in the process.

Just a suggestion, I'll leave it to the big cheeses to decide now...

[SloDaz]

Ok Drag's I will change my clan tags back to grrr but only because you asked so nicely (and thanks for the little white sweets - not sure if I remember the full conversation, its all a little blurry but it must have dragged out for a long time because my butt sure hurts :ky .