Ok, while the game is still fresh in my mind, this is what I saw go down.
First two or three rounds, we got owned. Most of us had terrible k/d's which is where we lost tickets. I managed to keep a postive k/d for each round, and I attribute this to me using the toob a lot and not running in blindly to the flags (not saying others did this, but just what I did). When I was successfull at this, usually being upstairs in a building, I was often the spawn point when the rest of the squad was down.
I did notice SSG use the assault kit and toob a lot, more than the other classes by far. I'm guessing many of us died to toobs. Toobs are one shot kills if your good with them, and I find easy to do, if I have a height advantage, so thats what I look for.
Armor didn't seem to help us a lot, but when the enemy had armor on A, unless we got engi's spawning, they held the flag.
I'm not sure what went down with the enemy laying mines, as I didnt follow this on ts, so maybe someone can fill me in on that.
The fights at C... we my squad didn't move into the flag often enough, when we had the roof covered. We seemed to be chasing the SSG guys around the sides too often. You need one decent toober on the roof at C, looking through the skylights to cover the rest of the squad capping the flag. If the enemy come in, like SSG did, the toober at the top can finish the enemy off, while the guys at the ground level, draw the enemy out of the edges of the building so they are exposed to toob fire from above.
Personally, I think B & C are the most important points on the map. If you control both of those and are in front of these points on the hills, you can fire down into the enemy as they approach. I think next time, we need to be more concious of holding B & C if we can, leaving A to the enemy. Only sending maybe one or two guys down to A, to keep the enemy busy there and feeling like if they all leave the flag, they will loose it.
Last, with no spotting, we need to work out a way, to call out which direction the enemy is approaching from (if a whole squad is coming in), so if we are spread out defening, watching the different approaches, we can all move in the direction of the enemy approaching, or take up our covered postions with their approach direction in mind.
Regarding the play fighting before the round starts. I personally find this a bit of a distraction, when we could be focusing on what we plan to do, and how we plan to do it.
Debrief - Friendly against SSG
-
ChaosADPumpkinHead
- Senior Member
- Posts: 164
- Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2007 2:18 pm
- Contact:
Re: Debrief - Friendly against SSG
Great post and good points all round.
Firstly, our armour was toast. SSG did lay mines very effectively and none of us took them out (shooting them destroys them). I also very seldom had an engineer near by to repair, so more often than not I simply left the APC. They are a very solid team and one thing I did notice is that each of their squads had a sniper who was throwing out sensors. So pretty much they knew where we were and we were shooting in the dark.
I can't really speak for what was happening in Bravo squad but in Alpha we seemed very disjointed. XennoX and Dingbat were moving well together but Krygorian and I were hardly ever in close proximity to them.
I find the 3D spotting not being allowed to be a huge disadvantage because I'm so used to spotting enemy after all these years of BF.
The main thing I was to take from this game is the fact that we should not RUSH into flags but rather focus on holding what we have. The map was great for defending and tough on the attackers. Patience is something we have to work on.
All in all not a bad display but we need to work on our togetherness.
Firstly, our armour was toast. SSG did lay mines very effectively and none of us took them out (shooting them destroys them). I also very seldom had an engineer near by to repair, so more often than not I simply left the APC. They are a very solid team and one thing I did notice is that each of their squads had a sniper who was throwing out sensors. So pretty much they knew where we were and we were shooting in the dark.
I can't really speak for what was happening in Bravo squad but in Alpha we seemed very disjointed. XennoX and Dingbat were moving well together but Krygorian and I were hardly ever in close proximity to them.
I find the 3D spotting not being allowed to be a huge disadvantage because I'm so used to spotting enemy after all these years of BF.
The main thing I was to take from this game is the fact that we should not RUSH into flags but rather focus on holding what we have. The map was great for defending and tough on the attackers. Patience is something we have to work on.
All in all not a bad display but we need to work on our togetherness.
Re: Debrief - Friendly against SSG
YEs sensors equal moui-importante, you need a recon guy to thourhg sensors all the time, Assualt dude must re-arm him constantly. Being recon doesn't mean sniper, use the M14 or such and you have another assault dude
-
Skouperd
- Senior Member
- Posts: 982
- Joined: Thu Mar 05, 2009 1:57 pm
- Location: Cape Town, Western Cape, South Africa
- Contact:
Re: Debrief - Friendly against SSG
I agree mostly with what you all said. Sensos was not used enough. Also, something I picked up though, was that people don't always show up on sensors for some reason, we need to figure out if that is a bug in the program, or if that is because of different "levels" (ground level, first floor, second floor, roof etc).
I am really disappointed in the way we've handled the APC (not just Chaos, but myself as well). It was as if we just did not had a chance in the armor. I think we need to look carefully at what the vehicle benefits do, I tend to use the driver machine gun add-on, but does it add value if we the passangers have additional armor, or the warhead perk etc. We need to investigate this.
The mines, that is one of the things I've suggested we do, and I still think we need to do it more.
Regarding attacking versus defending. As per my proposed strategy, I never intended us to go in and actually TAKE "A" but rather just cause issues for them. We need "C" and we can fight over "B". But "A" we just cause them to "worry" about it.
Our ticket counter improved considerably when we actually hold just "B" and "C", we need to do that more.
I did not realise one could actually destroy the building next to the flag at "A", we need to do that, since a lot of enemies hides in that barn.
My 2 cents.
I am really disappointed in the way we've handled the APC (not just Chaos, but myself as well). It was as if we just did not had a chance in the armor. I think we need to look carefully at what the vehicle benefits do, I tend to use the driver machine gun add-on, but does it add value if we the passangers have additional armor, or the warhead perk etc. We need to investigate this.
The mines, that is one of the things I've suggested we do, and I still think we need to do it more.
Regarding attacking versus defending. As per my proposed strategy, I never intended us to go in and actually TAKE "A" but rather just cause issues for them. We need "C" and we can fight over "B". But "A" we just cause them to "worry" about it.
Our ticket counter improved considerably when we actually hold just "B" and "C", we need to do that more.
I did not realise one could actually destroy the building next to the flag at "A", we need to do that, since a lot of enemies hides in that barn.
My 2 cents.
[TABLE]
<tbody>[TR]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
</tbody>[/TABLE]
Scientific fact, dried testicles of rhino poachers can cure aids.
<tbody>[TR]
[TD]
[/TD][/TR]
</tbody>[/TABLE]
Scientific fact, dried testicles of rhino poachers can cure aids.
Re: Debrief - Friendly against SSG
Well, that was a fun practice.
I did feel a bit like I was made of eye and they were made of pointed sticks, but for a first go, it wasn't that bad.
I would however like to know how we are picking the teams (ie what criteria do you need to meet to be on the team.)
I died a LOT. More than I probably should have, but given the task I was trying to do, it was expected that I would die more than I would kill.
If K/D ratio is a criterion for making the team, then my performance in the game puts me out of commission.
If you count the number of revives I did, it more than makes up for my deaths tho.
I want to be on the team.
If K/D is important, then I'll play sniper, hide in a bush with my new-found M95 +man stopping power upgrade, and probably end up with a positive K/D, but I can't say it will help the team tremendously.
On the other hand, running around picking up your corpses while catching knives and grenades in my back probably does help the team, but wipes out my K/D.
I know at BBH things were always about the team winning or losing, rather than the individuals.
Now that GRRR is here, I just thought I'd put these thoughts out there for discussion to see how things have changed.
Other stuffs:
Mines can be used to kill infantry. Put one by the flag, wait for infantry to enter building, shoot mine from nearby building.
We need to KNOW what the flag rate drop is PER SECOND when holding 2 flags and they have 1 (or the other way round.) I got the feeling you needed to have THREE flags before the tickets fell at a noticeable pace.
Traditionally, an attacking force needs 3 people for every 1 of a defending force. BBH is usually good at defence.
If it turns out that the flag drop is not too bad, we could actually make more points by getting the whole team to defend 1 flag, than running around like monkeys capping flags in circles.
Finally: We need a new motto: Something like "MIXED NUTS - WE TRY TO BE WHERE THE ENEMY BULLETS AREN'T" or some such thing to avoid k/d's like mine.
I did feel a bit like I was made of eye and they were made of pointed sticks, but for a first go, it wasn't that bad.
I would however like to know how we are picking the teams (ie what criteria do you need to meet to be on the team.)
I died a LOT. More than I probably should have, but given the task I was trying to do, it was expected that I would die more than I would kill.
If K/D ratio is a criterion for making the team, then my performance in the game puts me out of commission.
If you count the number of revives I did, it more than makes up for my deaths tho.
I want to be on the team.
If K/D is important, then I'll play sniper, hide in a bush with my new-found M95 +man stopping power upgrade, and probably end up with a positive K/D, but I can't say it will help the team tremendously.
On the other hand, running around picking up your corpses while catching knives and grenades in my back probably does help the team, but wipes out my K/D.
I know at BBH things were always about the team winning or losing, rather than the individuals.
Now that GRRR is here, I just thought I'd put these thoughts out there for discussion to see how things have changed.
Other stuffs:
Mines can be used to kill infantry. Put one by the flag, wait for infantry to enter building, shoot mine from nearby building.
We need to KNOW what the flag rate drop is PER SECOND when holding 2 flags and they have 1 (or the other way round.) I got the feeling you needed to have THREE flags before the tickets fell at a noticeable pace.
Traditionally, an attacking force needs 3 people for every 1 of a defending force. BBH is usually good at defence.
If it turns out that the flag drop is not too bad, we could actually make more points by getting the whole team to defend 1 flag, than running around like monkeys capping flags in circles.
Finally: We need a new motto: Something like "MIXED NUTS - WE TRY TO BE WHERE THE ENEMY BULLETS AREN'T" or some such thing to avoid k/d's like mine.
Re: Debrief - Friendly against SSG
I think the flag drop rate for only holding one flag, while the enemy has two, has little impact on the game, unless both sides draw it out to defend.
Regarding being a medic... if you revive more people than you die, it saves us tickets. If you kill more than you die, it costs them tickets. We need to find the right balance here.
And of course, clearly playing for the team is the objective. We either all do well, or not.
Regarding defending being easier than attacking, without being able to spot, its hard for a defending team to move in on the attackers, once the attackers get close. This can leave the defenders being picked off one by one, by an attacking squad with a medic rolling through.
Attacking you can keep your whole squad closeish to cover each other. Defending, you end up being spread out to be able to watch the different approaches while not sticking your head out to be sniped. So without spotting, I think you need more defenders than previously to counter attackers.
Regarding being a medic... if you revive more people than you die, it saves us tickets. If you kill more than you die, it costs them tickets. We need to find the right balance here.
And of course, clearly playing for the team is the objective. We either all do well, or not.
Regarding defending being easier than attacking, without being able to spot, its hard for a defending team to move in on the attackers, once the attackers get close. This can leave the defenders being picked off one by one, by an attacking squad with a medic rolling through.
Attacking you can keep your whole squad closeish to cover each other. Defending, you end up being spread out to be able to watch the different approaches while not sticking your head out to be sniped. So without spotting, I think you need more defenders than previously to counter attackers.
Re: Debrief - Friendly against SSG
I agree pmurgs. Just putting this thought out there tho:
If you are defending from off the flag: You know where they are going (the flag)
They don't know where you are (somewhere off the flag)
Without spotting, and with only 1 sensor which is presumably centred on the flag, I still give the defenders the advantage (unless they shoot each other in a circular irish firing squad scenario.)
If you are defending from off the flag: You know where they are going (the flag)
They don't know where you are (somewhere off the flag)
Without spotting, and with only 1 sensor which is presumably centred on the flag, I still give the defenders the advantage (unless they shoot each other in a circular irish firing squad scenario.)
Re: Debrief - Friendly against SSG
I agree pmurgs, there must be a balance. Having a medic does help, not just the revives but also the mdic packs - Krygorian - having a good medic will win us games, so i vote on the best mix to be included in matches, not just k/d stats. I must say that there was a lot of toobing, it seems like that map is designed for that sort of play. I was playing assult and basically got all my kills from the toob - it will be interesting to see how the other maps fair.
As for the ticket bleed, it seemed to go down soooo slowly that i wonder if it is even important to try and hold more than one base. I noted that when we attacked we lost loads of tickets. They had the defence advantage and we got mowed down. Would it not be better to stay in a defence position and rack up the kills. Lets face it, they cannot cap us out like in BF2, so we always have a spawn position. I do hear you about the issues with defence but i think we need to figure out what game play gets us the win...
Onother thing is about spawning where you are needed. There was a time when Chaos called for back up and it may have made more sense for a few people to spawn on him. I was wondering if we should not have four squads of 2. This way we still follow two squad leaders but could also switch squads and spawn where we are needed. Although i do admit that this may become confusing and actually hinder instead of assist...
Otherwise it was a good game, my best moment was at C when the enemy spawned at the back by the train. I had just spawned on pmurgs (who was obviously pooning from the roof :gun
. I looked down and popped a toob in the middle killing three - what made it special was that i was getting a hiding for most of the game and that made it all worth while...
As for the ticket bleed, it seemed to go down soooo slowly that i wonder if it is even important to try and hold more than one base. I noted that when we attacked we lost loads of tickets. They had the defence advantage and we got mowed down. Would it not be better to stay in a defence position and rack up the kills. Lets face it, they cannot cap us out like in BF2, so we always have a spawn position. I do hear you about the issues with defence but i think we need to figure out what game play gets us the win...
Onother thing is about spawning where you are needed. There was a time when Chaos called for back up and it may have made more sense for a few people to spawn on him. I was wondering if we should not have four squads of 2. This way we still follow two squad leaders but could also switch squads and spawn where we are needed. Although i do admit that this may become confusing and actually hinder instead of assist...
Otherwise it was a good game, my best moment was at C when the enemy spawned at the back by the train. I had just spawned on pmurgs (who was obviously pooning from the roof :gun
. I looked down and popped a toob in the middle killing three - what made it special was that i was getting a hiding for most of the game and that made it all worth while...
-
ChaosADPumpkinHead
- Senior Member
- Posts: 164
- Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2007 2:18 pm
- Contact:
Re: Debrief - Friendly against SSG
Aaaahhh 
, i did read the rules - i promise!!! 
Ok, although i dont remember that rule, i just found this post from Lee, who raised this issue with the admins...
QUESTION> 2. 2 Squads of 4. While this makes sense for fairness and admin of the
QUESTION> start of the match, is this the structure then for the entrire match?
QUESTION> It's a rule listed for the match start only and there is no indication
QUESTION> wether or not is continues throughout the game.
QUESTION> IE TEAMS MAY ONLY HAVE 2 SQUADS
QUESTION> The thinking is that the rules would not want to take the tactical
QUESTION> element of mutiple squads OUT of the game and therefore, the game
QUESTION> should not be limit during gameplay to just 2 squads, rather AS MANY AS THE GAME ALLOWS.
QUESTION> Please indicate if more than 2 Squads are allowed during a match.
RESPONSE: You can have any number of squads in the match. This was merely a suggestion so-as to ensure that you could communicate with your squadmates whilst they were dead to find out that they were loaded and ready to play. We might rephrase this rule to make it more obvious.
, i did read the rules - i promise!!! Ok, although i dont remember that rule, i just found this post from Lee, who raised this issue with the admins...
QUESTION> 2. 2 Squads of 4. While this makes sense for fairness and admin of the
QUESTION> start of the match, is this the structure then for the entrire match?
QUESTION> It's a rule listed for the match start only and there is no indication
QUESTION> wether or not is continues throughout the game.
QUESTION> IE TEAMS MAY ONLY HAVE 2 SQUADS
QUESTION> The thinking is that the rules would not want to take the tactical
QUESTION> element of mutiple squads OUT of the game and therefore, the game
QUESTION> should not be limit during gameplay to just 2 squads, rather AS MANY AS THE GAME ALLOWS.
QUESTION> Please indicate if more than 2 Squads are allowed during a match.
RESPONSE: You can have any number of squads in the match. This was merely a suggestion so-as to ensure that you could communicate with your squadmates whilst they were dead to find out that they were loaded and ready to play. We might rephrase this rule to make it more obvious.