GRRR Squad Forum

I told Huby last night that I'm gonna make a "stink" post today, but I don't like to moan or point finger.

I just try to learn from my mistakes and be a better player.
This being said I am part of a squad and I expect to get the right support just like the rest of the team relies on me to support them.

Here are few things that gripes me the most:
I can't perform if I have to take 2-3 hits before I get repaired(sometimes not at all). This should happen immediately after the 1st hit!?
I can't stand still if my gunner does not watch my ass & I get hit from behind. Our own tow took us out and enemy engi's without me knowing they were there!!
Stats don't count in clannies!!! This shit I've seen since BF2 days. All that matters is that when the round is over that your team won, not the amount of kills/deaths you had.
Spot Spot Spot!!!!!! At this point it's just not happening. It is such a great advantage "perk/tool" whatever u wanna call it!
We need to trust each other more. This I see so many times when we just having a normal open server game. Like Tygie pointed out so many times. We all look in the same direction and get's 1 in the bum.
This should be second nature(specially when it's grrr member/s playing with you) that you watch out for one another.

Now as most of us know armour is a slugish thing with limited view.
Remember I also engage the enemy and can't be aware of everybody/everything around me.
I rely alot on what ppl tell me about there position and intent.
When I get the call that I'm being repaired or the guy is getting out, I assume that the guy will leave me between the enemy and himself or that he will move to a position so I don't run him over. I also don't expect/want him to be behind me.
When I normally play as a repair okie I give the armour the right of way. So I move around him and not him around me.
Also when we do have 2 engi's repairing, please only 1 repair and the other watch his ass or help out with a rocket on the enemy armour. The idea is the same as the infantry squad(watch your buddy's back)

I do feel that our armour squad is not well oiled and does need a lot of practice. I'd like for us to have a practice night to sort out the armour and make changes if need be.
We have a good team and as soon as all this lil problems is sorted we gonna be a force to recon with.

This is awesome stuff, thanks for the effort pmurgs! If we can get even just the mumble chatter as well, that will be so valuable.

Things I noticed and think we should note:

1. We have to work on a system of securing our flanks, I saw us clumping up then paying for it a lot. Double kills must not happen.
2. Never spawn on your only flag when the enemy have pushed you off it and are capping. They will own you as you spawn.
3. Our tank needs to be more static in firefights and call when its going to reverse, spanners must assume the worst i.e. repair from the back corners.
4. If we kill their tank, we have to make a move for their TOW from the vanguard (Dry planting mines too maybe?) to keep it out the game.
5. 1st spanner is dedicated spanner except for quick errands, 2nd spanner is dedicated gunner/spanner, 3rd spanner defends back flag unless enemy armour is up.
6. Don't attack the enemy tank with our tank unless you have the above parameters met for the tank phase you are in. Rather wait for players and avoid destruction.
7. Don't run around corners in the vicinity of enemy lines: be careful for the first 1/3 of the journey, rush on the 2/3 and go super slow on the 3/3 part.
8. If your squad is not making progress, pull out, leave one entertainer and the rest flank. We can't go into every fire fight do or die; your ticket is important!

Some tactical things:

a) On the first round, no one capped Alpha - I remember sitting on it for a while, but had to move up and it was only capped some 45 seconds later or something. I will use the transport 50cal to cover my squad's rush. We need 3 spanners on the tank for a battle, so something has to give. I'll get in the tank as per usual until my squad spawns, then I'll out and into the humvee/vodnik. On US I'll follow the rush into B, on RU I'll flank around the highway for a Vanguard spawn point.

b) The US tank did great at the start, but our back flag plan failed. They used the highway to great effect to get in behind us and use the TOW. I reckon once Leppy chases away the RU tank on the start, go back and shoot 1 or 2 bursts into B then speed off down the highway to either engage their tank or drop the 3rd spanner at their back flag. If you don't spot the tank while flanking, zoom back to our back flag, then the back street and so on. But careful, be quick, don't linger.

c) Our RU tank went the wrong way and we had a mixed result. We have yet to pull this move off at the start of a match on Bazaar RU. It's a great move that gets our tank right in their faces and potentially puts our tank on their back flag with good sight on their tank coming out the base. We have to get it right tonight and tomorrow. We have a good offensive force, we can really make that round ours with two Engineers in Vanguard at the start of RU and a rocket/tank timed attack/trap.

d) We must be aware that all tank battles are about drawing the enemy tank into a trap of your design or attacking from the rear. When you are not absolutely best positioned to do either, you should play conservatively and focus on the infantry moving to rocket you. You don't have to relentlessly shoot at armour, rather shoot it to defend yourself and when you have a timed rocket strike trap/attack or back rage. The enemy will try everything they can to destroy you, be a bit coy, focus on survival.

e) I support Leppy 100%, the tank is a stressful role. Everyone in that squad needs surety to perform. Extra practice effort is required to get the system down pat. Don't be defence only oriented though, you should work on a trap move to engage, spanner, get in, reverse a way, spanner up fast, spread out, combi-fire the armour and splash-dmg his spanners by making sure rockets hit as close to the rear bottom (shoot from the side of streets extra engi's!).

pmurgs wrote:Ok, last night matches. Only remembered to record the rounds on Bazaar.

Round 1 http://youtu.be/MK2N5dEQKyg
Round 2 http://youtu.be/m2v5N_xraSU

No audio. Not prepared to use the beta version of msi afterburner which has audio support, cos I use msi afterburner to overclock my gpu's.

Thanks for this. Just going to talk about what I see.

Round 1 as RU:

You guys are taking way too long to get to B by going past Market towards and into Golden Room/Alley. I know this was the strat as outlined in the ATC created by Tyger. Here is the problem with going that route, the US get to B first and have a full cap on B by the time you get to Golden Room/Alley, they only need 1 player to hold you up there as the area funnels into doorways. While your squad is trying to get past the doorway they are sending players down B and into C.

If your squad gets wiped you now have to cross the road and get into C, problematic as C has many elevated postions for US to fire down onto you as you try to get in. Nevermind all the cover at the market area. Market is really hard for RU to clear so try keep it no matter what.

By the time you got back to B all momentum was lost. What time you did have in B was well played but you are stuck in a crossfire with US having both A & C flags.

Here is what I suggest for Round 1 as RU:

The squad needs to move up to B via Market using Curved Corridor, sure US will be capping B but from Curved they are cut off from C. If you split the squad or use the squad makeup I suggested, what you could do is send Squad B (3 x players) down Curved and Squad C into Market to cap the flag and then draw fire & engage the US. Now you have a foward team in Curved who if wiped are backed up by the C Squad (B can spawn off them). C squad are laying suppressive fire (they should have a support player). The other thing with this type of setup is that you have created a crossfire in what limted space the US have to manouver, if they want to step out and angle shots into Curved they are going to get hit by C Squad. If they want to shoot down B into market they will be easily targeted by B squad.

Mind you this is just the opening strat but it is important to lock down the US at B alley. Another thing to consider and a good reason to get to B as fast as possible is as follows. When US arrive at B first, the only advantage they have is they they are on the B flag first, nothing else is to thier advantge, they are hedged into a small space, easily grenaded and on the defensive. As RU you get make first contact and this placed you in the advantge as US are in reactive stance, with grenades, RPG's or M320's you get first supression in the first contact, giving you at 50% aiming advantge.

Guys really think about the two squads, if you start doing well at B that second squad can cause havoc by flanking, they also work as a spotter squad for the US APC if it comes down highway. The natrual talent is there, you use cover and back each other up well enough, you just look out of position and then on your back foot the rest of the round. I can see that as soon as the opening strat falls apart you seem to loose focus.

In the two squad setup I suggested, you will be able to use each other draw the US out, you will also be able to spot from two directions. The trick is to get into postion, grenade and shoot in, spot the enemy and work on wiping the squad. For this tactic to work your APC squad needs to hold the enemy APC back, they must always rush down the road traight out of RU spawn, at the end of the road they need to see if the US APC is there and engage from that position, with two engineers they should be able to keep them at bay or kill them. This is a hard one as some teams, when playing US will send the APC over the highway and into C, actually not a very good move as that means the APC is facing your TOW position. C squad can act as spotters, if they see the US APC coming on highway you have two choices, move the APC to A and try and cap or reverse and engage. Not perfect but the APC strat is a hard one to play, you need to be reactive and draw the enemy into your kill zone. If the APC slows down just a bit you will have more control over the outcome, rely on C squad to spot & cover your ass and move up and engage the US APC on your terms.

Round 2 as US:

Starts out well, hummer and APC going in the right direction. If you use the three squad system then. APC (A squad) goes same direction. B squad rush in alleway and cap B flag and C squad cap A flag and spot for the RU APC coming down the highway, if its clear they can move up and flank into B from highway alley. Your engineers do well enough in this round, the RPG's are on target, you just got put on a back foot because of the RU APC coming down highway and getting you in the ass.

With regards to APC movement and healing the driver does need to be more static but at the same time the engineers need to more aware of the direcion the APC is shooting towards, as squad you just need to play more games, work out the dynamics and you will be fine, the natural talent & aim is there, you just fall apart when the opening strategy fails.

Here is what I suggest for Round 2 as US:

APC squad goes down the road past A and hangs a right and then if lucky you will see the RU APC, try push them back into the road leading to RU spawn. If you win this battel the game is yours, from here on in you can work down that road keeping the RU APC stuck in and around its spawn. C squad needs to spot, if the RU APC comes down highway, turn around and engage them.

B squad goes directly in B alley, get the cap, hold the flag and look for kills, be conservative here, you need the flag & kills, you have the ticket bleed so no need to rush out of B. If all goes well with your APC squad the C squad should be able to go up highway and flank into C or B flag. They can even just hold back at A and shoot down B backing up the B squad. You should have two flags so just go for a slow methodic gamestyle of spotting, calling the location, getting the grenades and RPG's/M320 shots down B in Curved and C flag area. As US you just want to keep the fire up, supression is the key, make them come to you, you will get the kills if you dont bunch up and if some of you hold back to revive.

Overall I think your two squad strat is not working, there is no fluidity at the start of the game, I think good lessons were learnt here and the points L3pr3c4un and Hubris_za raised are valid, I really want to hear voice for these games so I can give more input.

For practice I suggest your try a 4 vs 4 with APC's only & and 4 vs 4 fighting for B flag only, just work on start round rushing to position, stay in the 3 squad setup and use the 4th player as a spotter to act as a C squad. Just work on getting to the APC battle in a good position and getting off the first RPGS shots.When you play squads in B alley work on getting to B fast and getting into position and throwing good grenades ect into predicted enemy locations.

I dont think you should play the game tomorrow and if at all possible move it out to next week. You need one more practice in a server as a team. These team practices where your infantary squad works as the enemy APC squad or your APC squad works as the enemy infantry squad can help bucket loads, it will give you a better perspective, you get to see what responsibilites your teamies have and you get to relax, chat on mumble and enjoy the game. If you do this twice before the next game you will be far better off than playing another team as a "practice" or rushing into the DGL game.

Thanks miles that's some invaluable analysis.

We are gonna play tonight, because we have to ist the only time both teams can make it.
Yes we need more prac and we will get it.
But i am confident we can take BUD's second team tonight.

We practised last night and the armour guys worked out their bugs on how to drive and repair.
Vanguarg practised assaulting the apc.

Couple of things.
Our strat on the RU side to go around the back. We decided that due to the fact that US get to the flag first.
But you make a very good point about why that doesn't matter.
However we are now going to use this as an all out assault on the enemy APC and make sure it goes down.
Yes we leave our back flag a tad exposed, but we expose their back flag and B flag for flanking which I think makes up for it.

I think we will take what you say into account and implement it next match. I think its too late now to change today.
We have drilled this and everyone knows what to do so i think its best we keep it as is.
Hubris maybe you using the vodnik at our back flag might not be a bad small change to make at this late stage.

For the rest i think we gonna kick their ass.
Lets remember this is a fire fight, each little battle matters. Be calm, be precise.
Mostly lets enjoy the challenge of out gunning and out smarting them.
If we have that enjoyment in our minds we will automatically play well.

Yea it is not worth trying to change it up at such short notice. You guys have put the work in and I am sure you will do well. Please try and record the game. I am really looking forward to seeing.

Good luck guys, remember suppression wins the day in BF3!

Awesome feedback, thank you, Miles. Looking forward to putting plans into effect tonight.